Two Americas
02-24-2009, 01:23 AM
Interesting news today. I was talking to a guy who designs automation systems for the major fruit packers here. All of the major packing houses have canceled all contracts for the rest of the year. This is odd. Always the equipment needs replacing, repairing, etc. To suddenly stop all contracts - and to have all of the packers do that over a week or two...
A couple of months ago everyone was optimistic for the usual reasons - "prices are strong, quality is good, we have a good harvest" - but now suddenly it is a panic and no spending.
The growers are in this ridiculously vulnerable position. When they harvest the fruit it has to go into cold storage, and that means take it to the packers (who control the market.) It sits there and the growers pay cold storage fees until the packer decides to "buy" it - which does not necessarily mean pay for it, but declare that it belongs to them so they can sell it, collect on it, and only then pay the growers.
So right now the packing houses are full of fruit - which the growers have not been paid for, but on which the growers are paying cold storage fees.
The packers have become increasingly reliant on the Far East markets, and that business has collapsed. So the fruit is not moving out of cold storage.
Now what? The growers can't go retrieve it and hang it back on the trees. The money has stopped flowing. The storage expenses continue. The packers are out of money - or at least will not spend - and can't sell so aren't buying from the growers. The whole area is dependent upon this money flowing.
Now what?
This is strangely different than anything I have seen before. It happened so quickly as well - from optimism to an absolute dead end in a couple of weeks, and no one has a plan or an idea as to what to do next.
Usually there is some crisis going on - short crop, poor quality, low prices etc. - and everyone would be yapping this time of year about what is going to happen, what to do. But now everyone is shrugging their shoulders and no one has a clue.
This time of year there is usually a lot of optimistic chatter about the coming season -"the block of such and such will finally be coming into bearing, prices on such and such are going to be strong next year" - but I don't hear any of that. What I do hear is people thinking the unthinkable - what if it doesn't bounce back? Then what?
This is all causing people to not spend. A huge number of Mexican and Guatemalan workers have left and gone home, and now people are realizing that they weren't a burden, weren't an expense, but were producers and spenders and now their contributions are not there and that has left a hole.
I don't know. This feels like big forces at work, like a downward spiral that is self-feeding and accelerating. The finance industry people are always saying that if people have confidence that the economy is good, then it will be good, and they blame the people for thinking it is not good and therefore causing it to not be good - such idiocy.
People are not spending, companies are not hiring, goods are not moving. What the hell is going on? People can't be "optimistic" when they have lost confidence in their income, or lost their income altogether. How can you have an economy based on consumer spending and confidence, and then not think that laying off millions of people won't cause a few problems? Where do the apologists for the damned system think those people go? Who do they think is going to spend? And people are not going to use credit now. They are struggling to pay off the debt they already have, to hang onto their homes.
The propertied people are trying to downplay the crisis and talk optimistically and ridicule the doom and gloom people. There have been a few threads lately at DU about property management issues - bad tenants, insurance, blah blah - and a lot of people posting on those threads apparently own multiple properties, rental properties, commercial properties. I looked at the user names and it was a who's who of the people who defended the bail out, who are pooh-poohing those warning of a Depression, who are blaming Labor and consumers and tenants, and who are minimizing the crisis. Hmmmm.
They are just hoping, aren't they? Trying to artificially pump up confidence, trying to breathe life back into the damned thing. Not because they have any "opinion" about this, but because they have property.
It looks to me like we are irrevocably on a downward trajectory. I can't see anything that anyone is suggesting that can stop this (other than here of course.)
A couple of months ago everyone was optimistic for the usual reasons - "prices are strong, quality is good, we have a good harvest" - but now suddenly it is a panic and no spending.
The growers are in this ridiculously vulnerable position. When they harvest the fruit it has to go into cold storage, and that means take it to the packers (who control the market.) It sits there and the growers pay cold storage fees until the packer decides to "buy" it - which does not necessarily mean pay for it, but declare that it belongs to them so they can sell it, collect on it, and only then pay the growers.
So right now the packing houses are full of fruit - which the growers have not been paid for, but on which the growers are paying cold storage fees.
The packers have become increasingly reliant on the Far East markets, and that business has collapsed. So the fruit is not moving out of cold storage.
Now what? The growers can't go retrieve it and hang it back on the trees. The money has stopped flowing. The storage expenses continue. The packers are out of money - or at least will not spend - and can't sell so aren't buying from the growers. The whole area is dependent upon this money flowing.
Now what?
This is strangely different than anything I have seen before. It happened so quickly as well - from optimism to an absolute dead end in a couple of weeks, and no one has a plan or an idea as to what to do next.
Usually there is some crisis going on - short crop, poor quality, low prices etc. - and everyone would be yapping this time of year about what is going to happen, what to do. But now everyone is shrugging their shoulders and no one has a clue.
This time of year there is usually a lot of optimistic chatter about the coming season -"the block of such and such will finally be coming into bearing, prices on such and such are going to be strong next year" - but I don't hear any of that. What I do hear is people thinking the unthinkable - what if it doesn't bounce back? Then what?
This is all causing people to not spend. A huge number of Mexican and Guatemalan workers have left and gone home, and now people are realizing that they weren't a burden, weren't an expense, but were producers and spenders and now their contributions are not there and that has left a hole.
I don't know. This feels like big forces at work, like a downward spiral that is self-feeding and accelerating. The finance industry people are always saying that if people have confidence that the economy is good, then it will be good, and they blame the people for thinking it is not good and therefore causing it to not be good - such idiocy.
People are not spending, companies are not hiring, goods are not moving. What the hell is going on? People can't be "optimistic" when they have lost confidence in their income, or lost their income altogether. How can you have an economy based on consumer spending and confidence, and then not think that laying off millions of people won't cause a few problems? Where do the apologists for the damned system think those people go? Who do they think is going to spend? And people are not going to use credit now. They are struggling to pay off the debt they already have, to hang onto their homes.
The propertied people are trying to downplay the crisis and talk optimistically and ridicule the doom and gloom people. There have been a few threads lately at DU about property management issues - bad tenants, insurance, blah blah - and a lot of people posting on those threads apparently own multiple properties, rental properties, commercial properties. I looked at the user names and it was a who's who of the people who defended the bail out, who are pooh-poohing those warning of a Depression, who are blaming Labor and consumers and tenants, and who are minimizing the crisis. Hmmmm.
They are just hoping, aren't they? Trying to artificially pump up confidence, trying to breathe life back into the damned thing. Not because they have any "opinion" about this, but because they have property.
It looks to me like we are irrevocably on a downward trajectory. I can't see anything that anyone is suggesting that can stop this (other than here of course.)