Some excerpts from Sara Robinson's excellent article:
"Is the US on the Brink of Fascism"
http://www.truthout.org/080909A


I've read this article several times and it is very scary, esp. when read while watching unruly mobs successfully disrupt the "town meeting" which does pass for an exercise in democracy.

My comments:
From the definition of fascism by Robert Paxton, Robinson quotes this phrase "liberal democracy stands accused of producing division and decline."
We have seen on hate talk radio and tv for decades "liberal democracy" is blamed for crime, social problems, you-name-it.

Another part of the definition "marked by preoccupation with humiliation or victimhood" - see Sarah Palin, and all the other talk-haters - they are always the victim, of the bad "liberal" media.

and "a mass-based party of committed nationalist militants, working in uneasy but effective collaboration with traditional elites, abandons democratic liberties and pursues with redemptive violence and without ethical or legal restraints goals of internal cleansing and external expansion."
Isn't this EXACTLY what is going on now?
The Republican party absolutely fits that definition.
The town hall thugs have abandoned the idea [if they ever held it] of democratic process.
They have 'gone over the line', there really is nothing they won't do.
If people haven't seen images of these meetings on TV, I urge you to, and I urge you to watch Maddow and Olbermann, who are doing an excellent job on this.

I believe that the manipulation of these thugs is not about health care - it is about - how far can we go? Exactly how much can we manipulate these people. When you see people RAPTLY listening as a speaker claims that the "reform" bill will force people to be euthanized, will bring about a Hitler/Pol Pot/Stalin situation, you really have to wonder - how far gone are these people.

What would it take next to rile them up to beat up immigrants, or blacks or gays?
Not much.

The Nazis didn't start by killing Jews and hom0sexuals and Communists and others, they started by disrupting meetings.

In the last presidential election, 45.7% of the people who voted, or almost 60 million people, voted for SARAH PALIN. She who is espousing the view that this "reform" bill will force people to have their down-syndrome babies euthanized.

Those 45.7% of the voting public did not then say, well we lost, we should try to win the next election.
They set out to destroy the democratic process which didn't work for them.

Sara Robinson: "Lacking legitimate routes back to power, their [GOP leadership] last hope is to invest the hardcore remainder of their base with an undeserved legitimacy, recruit them as shock troops, and overthrow American democracy by force. If they can't win elections or policy fights, they're more than willing to take it to the streets, and seize power by bullying Americans into silence and complicity."

She says with the alliance between the "mob" and the party congressional leadership takes place, "the transition to full-fledged government fascism begins."

"We know beyond doubt that the Teabag movement was created out of whole cloth by astroturf groups like Dick Armey's FreedomWorks and Tim Phillips' Americans for Prosperity, with massive media help from FOX News. We see the Birther fracas -- the kind of urban myth-making that should have never made it out of the pages of the National Enquirer -- being openly ratified by Congressional Republicans. We've seen Armey's own professionally-produced field manual that carefully instructs conservative goon squads in the fine art of disrupting the democratic governing process -- and the film of public officials being terrorized and threatened to the point where some of them required armed escorts to leave the building. We've seen Republican House Minority Leader John Boehner applauding and promoting a video of the disruptions and looking forward to "a long, hot August for Democrats in Congress."

Scary stuff: "If we can only identify fascism in its mature form—the goose-stepping brownshirts, the full-fledged use of violence and intimidation tactics, the mass rallies—then it will be far too late to stop it."


george

on edit: meant to type Paxton's definition of "fascism" not "democracy"

More misdirection. The Obama administration is more dangerous than this gang of hoodles. They are loud and noisy cause they are unopposed. Let the Dems mobilize people to counter the loudmouths, mebbe mix it up a little. Oh, I forgot, they don't do things like that, they just wring their hands.

Mebbe some cheese to go with the liberal whine. Do you like Limburger?

... then it's falling into it at light speed so far under Obama. Any administration that creates a flag@whitehouse.gov site to encourage citizens to turn in their neighbors for forwarding information that is not in lockstep with what the WH wants the message to be is fascism on steroids. Making the statements in the OP and then not even mentioning the Democrats do the same thing if not worse makes the author out to be the hypocrite that she is. "Truthout" is correct if what is meant is "out of truth mouthpiece for the status quo under Democratic party rule."

I, for one, am happy these people are speaking out. That's what freedom is all about, whether it be this or people gathering to protest war. All sides have an opinion, all sides have orgainzation, all sides have the right and obligation to speak out. I have no problem with people trying to derail Obama, the guy's a total a-hole.

I vote for declaring that the worst political article of the year.

There are some good comments about taxes in this article, but again the author is attacking the "tea-baggers" while neglecting to mention the Obama crowd's complicity in the whole matter.


The me-first, screw-everyone-else crowd
Nothing will keep the rich from whining about how tough easy street is

By David Sirota (Salon)

Aug. 8, 2009 | I know I should be mortified by the lobbyist-organized mobs of angry Brooks Brothers mannequins who are now making headlines by shutting down congressional town hall meetings. I know I should be despondent during this, the Khaki Pants Offensive in the Great American Healthcare and Tax War. And yet, I'm euphorically repeating one word over and over again with a big grin on my face.

Finally.

Finally, there's no pretense. Finally, the me-first, screw-everyone-else crowd's ugliest traits are there for all to behold.

The group's core gripe is summarized in a letter I received that denounces a proposed surtax on the wealthy and corporations to pay for universal healthcare:

"Until recently, my family was in the top 3 percent of wage earners," the affluent businessperson fumed in response to my July column on taxes. "We are in the group that pays close to 60 percent of this nation's taxes ... Think for a second how you would feel if you built a business and contributed more than your share to this country only to be treated like a pariah."

This sob story about the persecuted rich fuels today's "tea parties" -- and I'm sure you've heard some version of it in your community.

I'm also fairly certain that when many of you run into the me-first, screw-everyone-else crowd, you don't feel like confronting the faux outrage. But on the off chance you do muster the masochistic impulse to engage, here's a guide to navigating the conversation:

What they will scream: We can't raise business taxes, because American businesses already pay excessively high taxes!

What you should say: Here's the smallest violin in the world playing for the businesses. The Government Accountability Office reports that most U.S. corporations pay zero federal income tax. Additionally, as even the Bush Treasury Department admitted, America's effective corporate tax rate is the third lowest in the industrialized world.

What they will scream: But the rich still "pay close to 60 percent of this nation's taxes!"

What you should say: Such statistics refer only to the federal income tax. When considering all of "this nation's taxes" including payroll, state and local levies, the top 5 percent pay just 38.5 percent of the taxes.

What they will scream: But 38.5 percent is disproportionately high! See? You've proved that the rich "contribute more than their share" of taxes!

What you should say: Actually, they are paying almost exactly "their share." According to the data, the wealthiest 5 percent of America pays 38.5 percent of the total taxes precisely because they make just about that share -- a whopping 36.5 percent! -- of total national income. Asking these folks to pay slightly more in taxes -- and still less than they did during the go-go 1990s -- is hardly extreme.

Stripped of facts, your conversation partner will soon turn to unscientific terrain, claiming it is immoral to "steal" and "redistribute" income via taxes. Of course, he will be specifically railing on "stealing" for stuff like healthcare, which he insists gets "redistributed" only to the undeserving and the "lazy" (a classic code word for "minorities"). But he will also say it’s OK that government sent trillions of dollars to Wall Streeters.

And that's when you should stop wasting your breath.

What you've discovered is that the me-first, screw-everyone-else crowd isn't interested in fairness, empiricism or morality.

With 22,000 of their fellow countrymen dying annually for lack of health insurance and with Warren Buffett paying a lower effective tax rate than his secretary, the me-first, screw-everyone-else crowd is merely using the argot of fairness, empiricism and morality to hide its real motive: selfish greed.

No argument, however rational, is going to cure these narcissists of that grotesque disease.

© 2009 Creators.com

Either support the Democratic party and listen to and follow the progressive mouthpieces, or "descend into fascism." Such a cynical manipulation of people there.

And what is the political program we are to support, that we are to see as the only alternative to this "descent into fascism?" Incremental change kept strictly within these limitations - we are to advocate, consider and discuss nothing that could upset or interfere with the people running the system.

If it weren't for the conservatives bitching and moaning about death panels and commies, then people would maybe actually wonder what these proposed health care bills are all about.

More weak-ass shit that doesn't help the folks who need it most, that benefits the corporations, that continues to put the burden on the very people who need it lifted.

It's such a farce. I've somehow been sucked into an email list via my dad (an Obama supporter) and there's all this back-and-forth about socialism-this and right-wing-thugs-that, and no one is actually talking about the content of the reform bills.

More of the same. Only it's even uglier because it's trying so hard to pretend it's something it's not.

Just like how Afghanistan is now the 'good' war. And so on...

People show up saying "Obama's health care plans suck" and all you have to say is "yes, you are right." That puts an end to all of the drama. But people think they cannot say that - loyalty to the team must come first. It is effortless to peel 90% of the support away from the Republicans, and get into productive political discussions with people by simply not defending liberalism and the Democrats.

That means that defending Democrats and liberalism serves the practical political purpose of making it impossible to effectively counter the right wing. Now that is interesting, isn't it?

Have you seen any of the video of the townhall disruptors?? They're not outraged citizens, they're paid professionals.

But were it a matter of countering what they are saying - not my suggestion - it would be easy to do. But paid disruptors is hardly brownshirts or a descent into fascism, is it?

ain't so. Those guys are agents of the hard right and have the enormous resources of the right backing them up. Don't think its just Democrats they're targeting.

Don't know what your post or mine has to say about fascism, didn't see that as the issue being argued.

sure do sound like them, which doesn't preclude them being paid either. What a sweet deal for them....
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_mg7D3kYysfw/SftcuGfulnI/AAAAAAAAMyk/f08jeCVHidk/s400/MH001394.jpg

I went to the original article at Truthout and clicked on the links at the bottom of the page to learn more about the author. I did find suggestions there for countering the talking points of the thugs - the usual lame ass liberal stuff. Now I can't find it.

What I was trying to say -

* Countering the talking points of the thugs is not what is called for.

* Were it called for -were it a case of every day people spontaneously expressing their opinions rather than paid operatives intending to disrupt the meetings - then the arguments being used would not cut it.

* Paid Republican party operatives disrupting meetings does not necessarily mean a descent into fascism.

The only thing to add is that I don't think it is even possible that every day people hold the opinions that the plants are screaming over and over. Its easy to be a little confused on the specifics (which are a jumbled mess) but I don't think anyone this side of Richie Rich is against lowering health care costs and providing better care..even if private insurance takes a hit in the process

I mean if they're paid professionals, why would they necessarily be from the right? Seems to me the Democrats want this whole reform thing to fail too. They didn't have public televised forums about the Wall Street bailouts, or about the escalation in Afghanistan, etc.

But all of sudden the Obama Administration wants our input?

Sounds fishy to me.

There you have it. I wonder how many of those screaming meemies would have stood their ground if a cadre of mean-ass, pipe-hittin' commies had waded into that room? Not many, is my guess. I am not saying that we in the US do not have to worry about fascism, quite the contrary, but when the Black Shirts in Italy, the Brown Shirts in Germany or the Blue Shirts in Spain disrupted a meeting of their opposition, it was a little different than this...

The Obama administration hires them, sends them out to meetings. That rallies the troops to get behind Obama's plan and stop criticizing it, because it is "us versus them." The disruptors need to be to be just intimidating enough to scare liberals - not all that hard - "boo!! We are going to send Sara Palin and Joe the plumber after you wimpy liberals!" All of the loyal little Dems then get in line, and they refuse to hear any criticism of the Obama plan because "we all have to pull together against that mean ugly extreme right who are fascists OMG!!"

he's got his mailing list from the campaign and sends frequent updates encouraging neighborhood town meetings, walking your neighborhood, calling in your neighborhood (the databases are extensive and all manned by local dems), and the like through his "movement for America". I get this stuff all the time. Occasionally I get a plea to "do more" and attend one of their "intensive training sessions". I'll have to post one when I get it. No, thank you, Barack, I've got Yoga for my spiritual side and don't need your kool-aid seminar.

I didn't know they were sending out stuff like that. Beyond the campaign season.

LOL "intensive training sessions," that sounds hilarious.

Yes, definitely post some when you can!

;)


(Exactly, my friend. Exactly.)

The White House has been quick to defend these protests as well.

:starwars:

I still get stuff from them all the time. I don't know how widespread the mailings are. I may get them because I was a precinct leader.