"Portuguese and African Blood make up the Majority of the population."

"Europe now is the largest Destination for Immigrants and Russia is also a large Immigrant Destination(ex-Soviet Republics) along with Canada and Australia(which has strict Immigration Policy to keep the population down and standards up)"

OK, I've been ambivalent about banning people. I've never moderated or administered a discussion board. I know there's a tension between inviting participation and rejecting reactionary views.

This has gone too far. This racist asshole needs to be gone. If a poll is necessary tell me how to start one. Allowing this to go on is liberal tolerance at it"s worst.

I could go on, but it just makes me madder.

This needs to be stopped, period. There can be no reason for allowing this to continue. I vote with curt...

"Blood will tell" has no place in a serious political discussion - in any discussion.

Do we still "alert"? And if so, to what end?

Message moved to "T!me Out to Chill Out" forum. You can visit it [link:www.progressiveindependent.com/dc/dcboard.php?az=show_topic&forum=217&topic_id=151 | here] .

Fucking with this dude was insane from the outset.

n/t

Meet an honest to god (Norse God) "left-wing" Fascist. This is the way it has been going since the British National Party self-destructed. They have caught on, not only in Eastern Europe but also in Germany, Italy , England... even electing delegates to the European Parliment.

It starts out with social criticism, focuses on "money" and then moves on to immigrants and jews. Sometimes it is pure fraud, like "National Anarchism", but often they mean it... growing out of the "left-Nazi" theories of Gregor Strasser or the "mutualist themes" of people like Gesell. They always love Julius Evola. They often identify with European "Third Way" (read Nazi) movements. They also and always turn rabidly racist, especially when the moon is full. Fookin' werewolves, they are.

They have been recruiting on the fringes of left-liberal, hip-left, Green, New Age, and Conspiracy sites on the web. Are you surprised?

We are going to see a lot more of them, and some are much less obvious and more sophisticated than this... errr... "gentleman".

http://www.splcenter.org/intel/intelreport/article.jsp?aid=1058

I know this thread is dead now, but...

I have a friend in Oregon who was trying to explain some of this to me a couple weeks ago. Here in the west racial issues are different than throughout other parts of the country so I couldn't wrap my brain around WHY racist nuts were infiltrating what I've always known as anarchist types. (People I would say who are trying to live outside of a system, not "do" something to it.)

[div class="excerpt"]Anti-racist anarchists on the West Coast have been aware of national anarchists attempting to infiltrate and exploit their scene since at least 2005, when the Oregon eco-anarchist magazine Green Anarchy issued a warning: "If you encounter these people, don't be fooled by the surface similarities; treat them as if they were Klan members or Nazis."

Nevertheless, the doctrines of national anarchism seem to be making inroads into what Nicholas Goodrick-Clarke, a longtime researcher of esoteric Aryan racial cults, has called "a folkish or tribal revival among white youth who are beset by an acute sense of disenfranchisement."[/quote]

I can see why this would play well here. The west has really seen Libertarian interest because of that 'sense of disenfranchisement.' You couldn't swing a dead cat around here last fall without hitting a Ron Paul sign. And his supporters seemed to fall in one of two categories: small business owner/entrepreneur or young person.

Anyway, good stuff!


And RIP strange poster person.

Everyone has their opinions, if we are to be a Free Society and Enlightened we all need to listen to everyone's Opinion, not a left-right fight.

rubbish and deserve no wastage of time what-so-ever. This racist bilge is just such tripe.

"Free Society", "Enlightened" - peddle it somewhere else...

We're hear to talk about leftist political ideas. Your agenda is clearly very different.

Things are a little up in the air. I would say that we are not sure how to handle things like this, but I think the discussion about how we handle things is great and long overdue. Right now there is no "boss." I would like to see a procedure, decisions by consensus, elected reps, an appeals process, and absolute clarity about why and when we banish someone. I favor banning people based on political reasons, not on so-called behavioral issues, I favor the burden being placed on each of us to demonstrate continually that we share the group purpose, rather than having admins chase bad actors around the board. I don't care if a person is "rude" if they are pulling the same direction. I don't care how polite a person is when they are working against us. I do not understand how you can have a left wing group that is not founded on class struggle and where the group is not committed to defending and supporting the working class. Anything other than that is not left wing, in my opinion. Within that broad context opinions can vary, but if we don't agree on that then we are yet another right wing lite group of aristocrats and ruling class apologists.

But mostly, having an agreed upon purpose and direction will make any decisions about what to do about disruptors a lot easier. We haven't agreed upon why we are here and what we are doing. Leaving that vague and poorly defined - as is always the case - inevitably favors the disruptors. The reason that it is always left vague and poorly defined is because the so-called Left, such as it is in the US right now, is infiltrated and dominated by people who want to call themselves left wing while constantly promoting ideas that defend the ruling class. The red baiting here is so thick you can cut it with a knife, for example, and tolerating that is akin to welcoming speakers from white supremacist groups to an NAACP convention. If we defined terms and set a clear and unambiguous purpose and mission those using the progressive label and trappings as cover for arguing for the ruling class would not be able to play their game. It is that game - hypocritical and self-contradictory, convoluted and dishonest - that drives the general public away from the Left and prevents us from growing and reaching a wider audience.

It is very difficult to tell who is friend and who is foe. There are people here I have been talking to for 7-8 years who insist that they are allies, insist that they are left wing, yet when push came to shove they just tore into the leftists with every reactionary red-baiting right wing talking point in the book. Have they been fooling us all along? Are they fooling themselves? The liberals and progressives demand that we leftists see them as allies, but it is a one way street because they will not stand with us and will stab us in the back in an instant. When they can't get their way they pout and throw temper tantrums and then stalk off with great drama and fanfare. I have lost all patience with this game they are playing.

I now think that there is a small but outspoken and domineering group of people who pose as leftists, and are very clever at making that case and fooling people, for the purpose of driving things to the right and sabotaging the Left. I don't know how planned or intentional that is, but that is the practical effect. They entertain left wing ideas as a tactical move, for the purpose of drawing people into debates and wasting time, disarming and lulling people so they can move in for the kill should any serious left wing talk actually break out. They will sabotage the entire thing rather than let that happen, as we have witnessed here recently.

as we figure out how to balance member moderation, board integrity and discussion.

I think for the moment though, while everyone's hashing things out and crystalizing what we all want, people should continue directly addressing obvious problems but also hit alert.

TA and I are working closely right now but we have a few technical hurdles to occupy ourselves with while people talk (TA will probably manage to multitask better than I can). We're moderating very lightly and currently Megan, TA, DYEW and I have Admin privileges. Obvious trolls are easy, but others, as you noticed a few times already, will require a good consensus.

Please keep being vocal to define the direction the board takes while we're playing with server and software so we know what people want, what you'll put up with and what you won't iaw with the goals, you know, all that good stuff.

Consider it open season on PI's future for our current members ;)

and how come kid with a hole in the head's post about fucking asian women wasn't pulled?
It directly contradicts the stated mission of the board - of no racist, sexist, etc.
or is that just pretty words?

the admins have stated that the board is in "flux". That means they are working behind the scenes, some of that has to do with technical issues, and working out what this board will look like in the future (with everyone's input).

It is possible that they are going to miss an objectionable post now & then. I'm sure they would appreciate if you would "alert" if you have a problem with a post, rather than simply insulting people (doesn't make you much better does it?).

You just blew it. If you want to influence the direction of the group, what you just did with this post is not going to be effective. Trying to pressure those taking leadership here in to fighting your battles for you, trying to trip people in leadership up, or embarrass and undermine them, and making snarky little challenges is telling us that you are going to sit in the back seat and pester Mommy and Daddy about what the other kids are doing - "Mommy he hit me first." Step up and take some responsibility and work with us. If you are interested in stepping into leadership, then do it, don't sit in the back row jeering and manipulating people.

Do not try to pressure leadership here into taking an authoritarian position if you want to have any credibility and influence. I am not talking about rules, nor my ideas, but rather about how things work in the real world and how adults work together to get things done.

based on many many read posts, with the most disgusting racism and misogyny, then you ought to study more the theory and concepts that you think you are espousing.

Your view is so typical mainstream moderate liberal american - the individual supercedes the collective. yeah right.

It is entirely sufficient to read these threads once. Two times is not only unnecessary but a waste of valuable time.

Seriously. What are you talking about?

Challenge and debate the racism and misogyny you think you see on the thread where you saw it and in response to the person you are complaining about. If your assessment is accurate, I will be right there in support of you.

This approach you are taking will not fly.

If you have a point to make, then make it. If you think you are wasting your time here, then don't waste your time.

I took the time to answer your question in good faith, honestly and in great detail.

My assessment is correct. The post in question is not debateable in its racism and mysogyny.
Maybe someone else can find it. Search under kid.

Dig in and do the work and bring something of substance to our attention.

If someone made racist and misogynist comments that could be a good jumping off point for discussing those issues. Take the lead on it. Take some responsibility for your comments. There is no mob to rally, and no in loco parentis figures to appeal to. Requests went out for people to step up and assume leadership and to put in the work and discuss the problems with the group and offer ideas for overcoming those. Hardly anyone responded. You don't get to merely sit in the back row and jeer and disrupt and play manipulative power games.

We are now spending time on your gripe - vague and generalized and laced with insults of the people working to improve the board. Calling racism and misogyny on another member is merely an attempt at pressuring or embarrassing the people who are doing the work here, and as I said THAT is the one thing more than any other that will not fly.

For someone who *just* got here you sure have a couple of chips to grind. Three out of seven, totally out of the blue, are against Kid and your [link:www.progressiveindependent.com/dc/dcboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=103&topic_id=41135&mesg_id=41140|first 4] sure have a singular focus.

There was quite a long exposition of all this on PopI, a ways back. Some British "Left"-Nazi showed up on the board and was very cagey about who he was. We ended up talking about monetary theory and all kinds of shit before he went ballistic at the accusation of anti-semitism... "Why, yes... I am"

Anyway, there was a thread about all kinds of this left-Nazi stuff, and Julius Evola made the Asshole Gallery. Do you remember it? Unfortunately it seems to be missing from the archives... That sneaky Nazi fifth-column at work, again.

Anyway, if we get much more traffic from this crew, we'll have to recreate it.

The "left-Nazi" shit is supposed to appeal to the working-class but it never does. It appeals to non-union plumbing contractors who live in Florida and work out of their pickups (Joe?). It also appeals to small business owner/entrepreneurs or declassed young people, just as you say.

They are nothing to dismiss, though. They seem to have a lot more traction in Europe than the shaved head, Doc Martens kinda Nazi...

I ask because I have no recollection of Evola in the Asshole Gallery. Could be my memory though, its not 100% on that stuff sadly

You told me about the Nazi here before once, I don't remember that either..may have been before I got here though

Not remembering it either, but I was offline for blocks of time. (No biggy, but it's of interest to me and hopefully it can be recreated at some point.)

... on Tinoire's newer version of the board software. Maybe it was there and the search function wasn't picking it up. Evola was Asshole #11. You were in the debate with the English Nazi (the Gesell guy). We just didn't know he was a Nazi. Since that time, even Roberto Fiori has started quoting Gesell. See that... wait long enough and everyone becomes a "Distributist".

If I can, I will try to reproduce some of those threads on PI because those fuckers are becoming real.

about the origins of their, umm, tendency and they know enough to be more than a little defensive about it, sometimes lapsing into self-righteousness (how dare you..!)

"Nazis? us? you're trippin'! har har..errrr, right?" (looks around with mix of hopefulness and alarm)

I remember that guy on PI, he came over from RigInt I think.