View Full Version : Ukraine: Russian trade unionists and leftists oppose invasion of Ukraine
Labour Start
03-03-2014, 08:44 AM
LabourStart headline - Source: Praxis
More... (http://www.workersliberty.org/story/2014/03/02/russian-trade-unionists-and-leftists-oppose-invasion-ukraine)
Dhalgren
03-03-2014, 09:08 AM
I get that no one who possesses any sanity, at all, wants the mess in Ukraine to erupt into world war. But how can the US-owned fascist thugs be dealt with? If the US pumped 5 billion dollars into Ukraine over the last fifteen years or so, to build up an armed, nationalist/fascist proxy army, how c an that be countered? I agree with the Trots over at WSWS, Putin is an oligarchic monster - he only looks good when compared to Obama - and all the irons in this particular fire are bourgeois irons. But the working class is and will suffer under the fascist boot worse than under the corrupt, bourgeois loafer. Again, what can be done? folks on the sidelines can beat their breasts, shout slogans and hold "peaceful" marches all they want - the nazi thugs in Kiev could give a shit. Somehow, Obama has to be held accountable for this disaster - he won't be, but he should be. What a bunch of bone-headed, Pollyanna, high school dip-shits who surround Obama, the Dip-Shit in Chief. This will get much much worse before it ever gets better.
The Russian authorities arrest four or five hundred protesters in Moscow? Sounds about like what would happen in DC...if anyone ever protested there anymore...
blindpig
03-03-2014, 10:18 AM
Labor Start has got a lot of gall presenting this statement of a handful of petty bourgoise intellectuals as representing working class opinion. I'll bet this union is not representing the janitors.
Ukraine is mustering it's army. Given the ethnic mix that could be problematical, particularly if units are raised on a regional basis. Whose side are they on? Apparently all Ukranian Army units in Crimea have defected to Crimean authorities.
anaxarchos
03-03-2014, 10:32 AM
Labor Start has got a lot of gall presenting this statement of a handful of petty bourgoise intellectuals as representing working class opinion. I'll bet this union is not representing the janitors.
Ukraine is mustering it's army. Given the ethnic mix that could be problematical, particularly if units are raised on a regional basis. Whose side are they on? Apparently all Ukranian Army units in Crimea have defected to Crimean authorities.
Association of Professors and University Lecturers...
Meaningless.
Probably pissed off about the impact of the Ukraine on twitter feeds and job searches in Western Europe.
Comrade
03-03-2014, 11:03 PM
LabourStart headline - Source: Praxis
More... (http://www.workersliberty.org/story/2014/03/02/russian-trade-unionists-and-leftists-oppose-invasion-ukraine)
Note that the link goes to the “Workers Liberty” website. “Workers Liberty” is a “Trotskyist” cult in Britain that was obviously set up by the MI5, the MI6 or both. They supported NATO’s criminal attack on Yugoslavia, the illegal invasion of Iraq, the equally illegal bombing of Libya, and they support the terrorists in Syria. It’s no surprise then that they also support NATO’s fascist coup in the Ukraine.
By the way, they’re also totally lying about Russian and Ukrainian leftists. The real leftists in Russia and the Ukraine are the communists, and both the KPRF and the KPU fully support Russian military intervention. Only pro-West liberals funded by the US State Department oppose it. Demonstrators in Russia supporting anti-fascist intervention in the Ukraine heavily outnumbered the handful of Western-funded, fake “peace protestors.”
The only kind of “peace” that “Workers Liberty” wants is Pax Americana.
anaxarchos
03-04-2014, 12:04 PM
Five years ago, the capitalists and their liberals scoffed at the idea that war and fascism were the inevitable results of their world-wide depression. Today they organize the chorus, led as always by their apologists.
The most notable feature of the "Ukrainian Crisis" is how bold they have become... a direct result of their increasing desperation.
Dhalgren
03-04-2014, 01:25 PM
After Kid mentioned Babu, I remembered an article I had read a while back by him - A New Europe: Consequences for Tanzania, 1991. I went back and looked it up.
There on the first page was as prophetic a statement as I have seen. He said that when Gorbachev made his famous (infamous) speech in Finland in 1989,
in which he called for a 'common European home' shock waves went through the radical Third World. Our experience of a common European home forged by the pre-World War One 'Great Powers' - Britain, Germany, France, Tsarist Russia and the Austro-Hungarian empire - is not exactly pleasant. December 1989 will certainly go on record as one of the most decisive turning points in history since the end of World War II. Its significance must not be seen from the point of view of the cold war's so-called 'numbers game', but in terms of Europe returning to its pre-World War One imperial menace - the Europe which has done so much damage to the rest of the world in conquest, slavery, colonisation, settlerism, distortion and diversion of our national histories, through the massive devastation of world wars, the depletion of our resources, and the endangering of the world's environment.
I am really surprised and dismayed that there is nothing of Babu's writing on the nets. I found this article in a journal - Review of African Political Economy. His writing IS a great source for anti-imperialism...
Kid of the Black Hole
03-04-2014, 01:31 PM
After Kid mentioned Babu, I remembered an article I had read a while back by him - A New Europe: Consequences for Tanzania, 1991. I went back and looked it up.
There on the first page was as prophetic a statement as I have seen. He said that when Gorbachev made his famous (infamous) speech in Finland in 1989,
I am really surprised and dismayed that there is nothing of Babu's writing on the nets. I found this article in a journal - Review of African Political Economy. His writing IS a great source for anti-imperialism...
I hope you have his book African Socialism or Socialist Africa. If so, why have we never talked about it before?!
Dhalgren
03-04-2014, 02:21 PM
I hope you have his book African Socialism or Socialist Africa. If so, why have we never talked about it before?!
I do not have the book, but I will get it. Then we can talk.
anaxarchos
03-04-2014, 02:27 PM
After Kid mentioned Babu, I remembered an article I had read a while back by him - A New Europe: Consequences for Tanzania, 1991. I went back and looked it up.
There on the first page was as prophetic a statement as I have seen. He said that when Gorbachev made his famous (infamous) speech in Finland in 1989,
I am really surprised and dismayed that there is nothing of Babu's writing on the nets. I found this article in a journal - Review of African Political Economy. His writing IS a great source for anti-imperialism...
The biggest change since Babu's time is the appearance of the same actual classes as existed in the home countries of the previous colonies. During neo-colonialism, they existed only as proxies of the imperialist powers. Thus the "national bourgeoisie" was often composed only of a handful of military officers, former colonial officials, and intellectuals. This is the secret to how they could become "patriotic" and how that patriotism could be manifest as Arab-Socialism, African-Socialism, etc.
In turn, such a national orientation - by proxy - offered the only possible road to independence. Of course, the dialectic of it is that to the degree such regimes were successful, true national states were created with their own classes, their own class struggle, and with that... the end of the conditions which had created the possibility of a measure of real independence and progress in the first place.
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